On last.fm: R.I.P. MJ
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I'm not buying it.
Nice try, but I found this to the one a rather lopsided commentary. Let's get someone writing a counter point. Please don't get me wrong, I like innovation. However, I do not consider Microsoft to be innovating. Pretty much, I say they've just bundled in other companies basic ideas, and tried to lock them out.
Carroll used the analogy "don't like getting beaten by the competition in track meets, make the competition wear lead underwear".
However, WHAT IF the company (a monopoly making tracks) made the track that the track meet is running on , then specified that its own contestant entries (lets called them Internet Explorer, or Media Player) must be included in every track meet run on that track. (you know, bundled)
Not only that, but the track is made a certain way, and the company only tells it's own contestants how to design their sneakers to take advantage of the track (we'll call this an API).
I don't think that would be fair in the competition, and someone would rule it's not right.
What's next, bundling subscription anti-virus software. Trying to exclude other platforms (oh, wait, MSN tried that with browsers). Maybe specifing that MSN must be used with Windows, if you don't like it use another OS.
Imagine if the local phone company (when it was a monopoly) raised their prices $5 a month, and gave away phones. But alas, the phone monopoly was broken up, allowing competition.
Posted by: el1jones   Posted on: 03/30/04 You are currently: a Guest | Members login | Terms of Use
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Anti-trust needed...  Tim Patterson | 03/30/04
Amen to that! (nt)  el1jones | 03/30/04
Numbers speak for themselves  Christopher McLendon | 03/30/04
Misleading...  Tim Patterson | 03/30/04
Misleading  tomaras@... | 03/30/04
this is way to confusing  V Sanders | 03/31/04
Statistics, not features, are all that matters  mtl | 03/31/04
I agree, but  rapson | 03/31/04
Yes they would.  STDog | 03/31/04
What numbers?  zd-spam | 03/30/04
Anti-trust needed...  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
Oh Geez ... Here we go ...  coffeenite | 03/30/04
Oh Geez ... Here we go ...  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
Reverse MS logic...  MacCanuck | 03/30/04
Reverse MS logic..  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
Taking over  MacCanuck | 03/30/04
Taking over  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
Ignore SeoSamh. He is like Bit Byte.  systemcleaner | 03/30/04
Ignore SeoSamh. He is like Bit Byte  seosamh_z | 03/31/04
Welcome to the club  rapson | 03/31/04
You need humans  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
you ignore leverage john  hipparchus | 03/30/04
John, you're good at obfuscating the situation...  MacCanuck | 03/30/04
stop making excuses for stupid people!  stephen732@... | 03/30/04
stop making excuses for stupid people!  tomaras@... | 03/30/04
really pitiful argument  zd-spam | 03/30/04
Get it? Too hard for you to understand?  systemcleaner | 03/30/04
Wow John, your true colour are showing  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
My favorite color is "red"  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Misdirection, the magician's tool  Fred Fredrickson | 03/31/04
No magic to it  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Are people arguing about the same thing here?  Zogg | 03/31/04
That's what they do  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 04/01/04
Not adding up...  Zogg | 04/01/04
Come on John  bgoss@... | 03/30/04
I can't believe you said this...  Rodney Davis | 03/30/04
Functional replacements  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
I appreciate your point, but...  Rodney Davis | 03/31/04
But that's just it  rapson | 03/31/04
Striving to Monopoly is the NORM....  quietLee | 03/31/04
I'm not buying it.  el1jones | 03/30/04
I'm not buying it.  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
BTW, MSN is not a monopoly. -- HUH?  coffeenite | 03/30/04
BTW, MSN is not a monopoly. -- HUH?  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
"Ever heard of AOL? Proprietary software required." HUH?  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
What?  coffeenite | 03/30/04
You don't NEED it  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
"Ever heard of AOL? Proprietary software required." HUH?  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
I love analogies  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Media PLayer is just a very good media player  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
re : Media PLayer is just a very good media player  V Sanders | 03/31/04
re: I love analogies too  stephen732@... | 03/30/04
you dont  JoeMama_z | 03/30/04
Because...  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Piss off John....  TrollSlayer | 03/31/04
Ah! The bottom line...  Zogg | 03/31/04
Of course you do  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
That's because they are effective  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
At misdirection  Fred Fredrickson | 03/31/04
pro M$??  benopdezolder | 04/06/04
Maybe Legislation is not the way to go  DevilsAdvocado | 03/30/04
re: Maybe Legislation is not the way to go  stephen732@... | 03/30/04
IBM & Anti-trust  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
The Lone Ranger  DevilsAdvocado | 04/01/04
Monty Pynthonesque... but probably spot on. (nt)  Fred Fredrickson | 04/03/04
Yeah, umm...  Bob/Paul | 03/30/04
Convince your family to run Linux  cchenoweth | 03/30/04
GE analogy flawed  voska | 03/30/04
GE analogy flawed  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
I agree with you  voska | 03/30/04
Not so flawed as your rejoinder  Mack DaNife | 03/30/04
Not so flawed as your rejoinder  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
That dodge engine  voska | 03/30/04
That dodge engine  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
Are you serious....  DarbyOhara | 03/30/04
Free speach  Ardian Daka | 03/30/04
She has rights too  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
That's all well and good  John Dulles | 03/30/04
you are adding points...  ryusen | 03/30/04
Not Quite  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
I'm saying there are reasons why the market has coalesced around Microsoft  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
Lots of people conclude the wrong thing  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Not Quite  dshans | 03/31/04
About time...  Patrick Jones | 03/30/04
Deferral  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Oh.  Patrick Jones | 03/31/04
No, Microsoft's business practices a BIG mistake.  DonnieBoy | 03/30/04
Governments "interfere" with design all the time - for the better  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
Microsoft security  voska | 03/30/04
Governments "interfere" with design all the time - for the better  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
No difference  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
No difference  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
re: just one code.  ryusen | 03/30/04
re: just one code.  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
what force?  ryusen | 03/30/04
what force?  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
yep  ryusen | 03/30/04
This isn't security regulations  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Misrepresentation?  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
Connecting the dots  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
wrong analogy  NemesisNL | 03/31/04
Radio airtime has ALWAYS been open  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Then why  NemesisNL | 03/31/04
This isn't security regulations  dshans | 03/31/04
guess  richhayes | 03/30/04
Talk about what you know about...  quietLee | 03/31/04
I can't agree with you less, John.  Mack DaNife | 03/30/04
All good reason for using Linux  voska | 03/30/04
Re: All good reason for using Linux  Mack DaNife | 03/30/04
exactly  V Sanders | 03/31/04
I can't agree with you less, John.  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
re:  ryusen | 03/30/04
re:  seosamh_z | 03/30/04
re:  ryusen | 03/30/04
re:  seosamh_z | 03/31/04
maybe...  ryusen | 03/31/04
Some responses  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Media Player is more API than user application  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
Small correction...  Fred Fredrickson | 03/31/04
power of the  NemesisNL | 03/31/04
Drugs obviously better in Ireland...  scotus | 03/30/04
API  Ardian Daka | 03/30/04
You will note that my response...  scotus | 03/30/04
Anti-trust outdated - your very arguments say otherwise.  mathandmetal | 03/30/04
Uh, Mr. Carroll: MS is a *lawbreaker*. They require oversight.  ordaj@... | 03/30/04
You have it backwards  Mark Gist | 03/30/04
Overflow  pj-xmesh | 03/30/04
Knew it was JC from the title alone ... big bias here  oldskool | 03/30/04
Agree and disagree John.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
They have to try to maintain their market capitization  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
I really think it's more about egos.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
fully agree about the egos (nt)  ryusen | 03/30/04
I think 2 separate MSs would lose market share & value  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
Maybe, but does it matter?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Maybe, but does it matter?  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
Re: Maybe, but does it matter?  none none | 03/30/04
computting is not a zero-sum-game  oldskool | 03/30/04
Never thought bitty would come around ...  oldskool | 03/30/04
Yes, no and maybe...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Standardisation would improve MS productivity  oldskool | 03/30/04
why can't....  ryusen | 03/30/04
POerhaps if you were open to other opinions...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
who's not reading who's posts well?  ryusen | 03/30/04
I see...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
The core issues  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
See no evil?  Robert Crocker | 03/30/04
You've missed something critical  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
No one is missing anything...  scotus | 03/31/04
REAL?!? SUBSTANTIVE?!?  Robert Crocker | 03/31/04
John, that's because the whole  ordaj@... | 03/30/04
Before the antitrust trial  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
John, that's the point...  ordaj@... | 03/30/04
Counter points to consider John  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Interesting points  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Ehm not quite  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
Your not listening John.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Was it the first building you designed?  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
No, it was the first time I had this inspector.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Again, good point  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Let me clarify if I can.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/31/04
Middle ground: Stop breaking the law and...  scotus | 03/31/04
Stop the spin ... focus on the core issue  oldskool | 03/30/04
Are you serious?  Mack DaNife | 04/01/04
You negledted to mention the antipathy of the big IT outfits  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
core issues  Mack DaNife | 04/01/04
removing media player...  ryusen | 03/30/04
locked out  richhayes | 03/30/04
psychologically...  ryusen | 03/30/04
psychologically  richhayes | 03/30/04
really?  ryusen | 03/31/04
you are wrong  V Sanders | 03/31/04
You are wrong too.  Fred Fredrickson | 03/31/04
wow... you should get a job doing this...  ryusen | 03/31/04
Indeed, you're very predictable  avdp | 03/30/04
Predictability  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Wrong  j.m.galvin | 03/30/04
That IS a ruling  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Wrong again  j.m.galvin | 03/31/04
every reason to expect  avdp | 03/30/04
Stallman and Carroll are predictable...  scotus | 03/30/04
Apple's and Oranges  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
This I disagree with  Michael Kelly | 03/30/04
The essence of the problem  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Text editing vs. media playing  Michael Kelly | 03/30/04
why it's wrong...  ryusen | 03/30/04
Re: why it's wrong...  none none | 03/30/04
Of possible interest  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
WRONG!  Robert Crocker | 03/30/04
COWABUNGA!  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Re: Integrating GOOD technology  George Jay | 03/30/04
good point ... MS has kill VC market for SW companies  oldskool | 03/30/04
VC  A.Sinic | 03/31/04
try to get money ... anti-MS strategy a top concern  oldskool | 03/31/04
No one said it was easy  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
So what you're saying is ...  George Jay | 04/01/04
oh, puh-leeeze!  Robert Crocker | 03/31/04
COWABUNGA......  dshans | 03/31/04
Oh Carroll you got me eatin' my heart away...  BanjoPaterson | 03/30/04
It's NOT about MEdia Player!  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Correct  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
But the fact is...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
Okay  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Sale on red herrings!!!  Robert Crocker | 03/31/04
Re: There should be limits on what governments are allowed  George Jay | 03/31/04
Re: The notion that consumers no longer have control  George Jay | 03/30/04
If I remember correctly...  Michael Kelly | 03/30/04
the REAL problem is MS introduces new formats  oldskool | 03/30/04
So was the OJ verdict  Harvey Birdman | 03/30/04
Thank GOD the EU has more brains than most folks...  realitycheck101 | 03/30/04
I wish you could articulate a thought without the foolishness.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/30/04
WHAT technology?  Yagotta B. Kidding | 03/30/04
How much would this slow development?  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
Inclusion as API, not UI  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/30/04
Hmmm  NemesisNL | 03/30/04
re:  ryusen | 03/30/04
US COA also said MS needed to allow removal by user  oldskool | 03/30/04
The most flawed logic yet  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
What a surprise  zd-spam | 03/30/04
That's because ...  George Jay | 03/30/04
"Integration" is really bundling by another name  George Jay | 03/30/04
News Commentary EC's Microsoft ruling--a big mistake Penalizing the formerly legal - farcical logic  Fred Fredrickson | 03/30/04
What'd you do to the title?  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 03/31/04
Ah, my secret...  Fred Fredrickson | 03/31/04
John you are boring and too predictable and you are wrong.  systemcleaner | 03/30/04
If only MS would just drop the pretence ...  jellyclock | 03/31/04
We need the standards that Microsoft Provides  MSG_z | 03/31/04
Why must it be MS-created...  MacCanuck | 03/31/04
Response  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 04/01/04
Are you suggesting everyone fold up shop  MacCanuck | 04/01/04
EC's ruling  joseph.like@... | 03/31/04
"design decisions for Windows get taken away from programmers "  rfuller@... | 03/31/04
Capitalism  Mydrrin | 03/31/04
Do I smell an alternative agenda?  Beejaybee | 03/31/04
Do I smell a hidden agenda?  Beejaybee | 03/31/04
EU cash raid on MS  wbathurs | 03/31/04
Perhaps the same could be said of the case in Japan?  B.O.F.H. | 04/01/04
Where are those talented critics?  AdeOghert | 03/31/04
EC doesn't have vested interest in keeping MS powerful  YuridaMan | 03/31/04
Economics  bjbrock | 03/31/04
John professes to have a degree in economics ...  George Jay | 03/31/04
Because John doesn't have a degree in Computer Science  George Jay | 03/31/04
Degrees  John L. Ries | 04/03/04
It's a common complaint  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 04/01/04
Re: It's a common complaint  George Jay | 04/01/04
Amazing as it may seem...  scotus | 04/01/04
BTW, the assumptions required for...  scotus | 04/01/04
more then a big mistake  V Sanders | 03/31/04
Some thoughts  John L. Ries | 04/03/04
Calling John's bluff  Robert Crocker | 04/03/04
Bush's Blunder in Iraq might explain ...  mikemikef | 04/05/04

What do you think?

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