NSA spying comes under legal, political attack

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Reasonable answer

Since you gave a reasonable answer, I will try to do so also.


"""No he leak parts of a classified document (that rightfully he could, at his sole whim, declassify) that supported his goals to attack Iraq while suppressing the parts that did not support the war."""

As you say, he can do that and the part he did "Leak" was never pointed out as a major point just a point.

""" Other than the UK (which seriously questioned the intellignece from the US in internal discussions) NO OTHER COUNTRY on the planet supported the case for WMD in Iraq."""

Russia, France, Germany, the UN and many other countries all agreed that based on the intelligence they had, Iraq has WMDs. Now most disagreed with attacking Iraq but none doubted the intelligence.

""" Ommission of truth is tantamount to a lie."""
Truth, as based on what has been told to you by many different people and telling that truth, even if you omit parts that disagree with you is not lieing.

""" Not only did he lie about that, but he lied to Congress about this very same wire-tapping program. These lies were made while the President was under oath. thomasgclough wins that point.
"""Where did he lie? He reported to the heads of the intelligence committee as he was required to. He reported that while one part of the conversation was based overseas, there were some that either started or ended in the US. As far as I know no one has ever stated that the NSA ever monitored calls only within the US. This is all he is required by law to do.

"""This country is ruled by law. Our freedoms are based entirely on this premise. If dubya thought the FISA was unconstitutional, then he should have directed the AG to take it to Court. Breaking the Constitution with his own actions through the NSA is not in any way justified by claiming the FISA is bad and unconstitutional. The Constitution DEMANDS checks and balances. """

Every president since this law was passed has made the same claim and everyone has done the same thing the president has done. The "Checks and balances" were broken when the congress voted itsself and the courts more say in what had always been the area of the president.

"""Dubya has fought viciously to circumvent that. Specter even recognizes that and wishes to blunt the huge problem it represents to the Reps looking for office in November. thomasgclough wins that point too."""

If anything I see it the other way, that the president is doing everything he can to keep the courts and congress from oversteping what has always been the boundries. The courts are already doing that by "Making" laws according to what they think instead of what the constitution says.


"Just because I haven't been "draged (sic) you out for questioning" doesn't matter. Many have and many of these have been denied their constitutional liberties such as a right to representation, the right of trial and the right to confront their accusers. Once you start obviating these rights FOR ANY REASON, you invite that same treatment for yourself."""

And just who are those who have been denied this? People captured on the battlefield. People who were not in the uniform of any country. A fact that denies them (if push came to shove) the right to claim any right under the rules of war as agreed on by almost all countries. The fact that they are being treated as POWs is a plus for them and also POWs do not have a right to a civil trial or lawyer or anything like that.

"""If you can't grasp that simple concept, try reading some of Washington's, Jefferson's or Franklin's letters. They knew this first hand. The biggest problem is that once the precedent has been set, the next President may be even worse and especially one to your distaste such as another Clinton. Too bad for you. thomasgclough wins another point..."""

I have read all of the people you cite and their biggest fear was the courts or congress would become a de facto ruling body. That is why all 3 branches are suppose to be equal. As it now stands congress is trying and the courts have become rulers unto theirselves. Of course the next president (no matter which party) could be worse but they could be worse no matter what this president or the ones before him did or did not do.

"""As for "sleeping" with big oil. That's an obvious conclusion. One need look no farther than the Vice Pres. to get that one. Try to remember back a little bit. Elisabeth Dole dropped out of the 2000 primaries because as she stated there was no way she (or anyone else) could compete with the campaign contributions and funding of the Bush camp. Now that ought to tell you something. Hint (since you obviously need it): where did he get the cash in 2000?"""

This is nothing new, from the time we started having elections certain people, parties and companies have been for certain parties. The ones that agree with them and the people trying to come in are always going to be at a disadvantage to the people already in or the one the money people think has the best chance to win. If you have an idea of how to make it better and fairer, without trampling the rights you talk about I would love to hear it and who knows I might even agree with you.

The fact of the matter is, no matter who the president is or what party they belong to, there are going to be people who either disagree with everything they do or think they are the greatest thing that ever happened. Then you have the rest of us who agree with some things disagree with others and are not sure about the rest and hope for the best.

Posted by: richhayes   Posted on: 04/28/06 You are currently: a Guest | Members login | Terms of Use

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