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I think it is time for an open and honest debate on H-1B visas and foreign students. This is a debate the CONservative republicans do not want; as they are clearly in the pocket of big business.

Far too many, especially Asian and Middle-Eastern students come here to get an education, and do NOT leave. It is obvious, from the first day of class at a university they never had an intent to "go home." It is time to stop that. Why should international students take education slots from U.S. Students? These same international students then stay in the U.S. and take jobs in the U.S.

I recently completed my doctorate at a large state university. I lived in graduate student housing for several years while I completed my studies and my dissertation. Several things were noted and I share.

This typical behavior for students from China and the somewhat middle east. Typically about late June, they come to the U.S. It is nearly always a newly married couple. The husband is the student. It was typically and arranged marriage. Typically the wife is pregnant by late August. She has the baby in late May or early June. That baby is automatically a U.S. citizen! The baby then receives aid to dependent children (A.D.C.). There is no recourse against the parents as they as not U.S. citizens, the baby is.

The wife immediatley becomes pregnant again. So then there are two (or more) children in quick order. Both of the children are getting ADC! After the two children the parents then apply for asyllum in the U.S. as in China, in most parts, it is illegal to have more than one child.

The husband is most often getting a steipend for "working" or research, so he gets living money and tuition waiver. This is also government money. most often. After four or five years the husband has completed his "studies" and the wife starts her "studies".

During this same time "relatives" come to visit, and then often do not go home. At my university, in the graduate student housing, it was not unusual for three or four "relatives" to be living in the apartment, plus the students and their babies. No remember also the graduate student housing apartments are university owned, and are tax exempt, so the rents are much lower.

When the wife finally graduates the children are usually well into the public school system. In most states, including here, the bulk of school expenditures for K-12, are from property taxes and student housing does not pay any, plus the children continue to receive ADC. This is a nice little game. After they education of the parents is finished they make every effort to stay in the United State rather than go home. The education they received ultimatley did not benefit their home country and they used the backdoor to immigrate to the United States.

It is time to put a stop to all of this. When I first started on my doctorate I was told the above story, and did not beleive it. I confirmed it by seeing it up close and personal over several years.

I should also point at that at my university, many of these students were studying nuclear engineering and computer science. Hmmm, do we wonder how certain "third world" countries got the advanced nuclear technology. Worry not, we trained them! This is very wrong.

It is time to put a near total stop to H-1B visas and grossly cut back student visas. So-called students should not be allowed to receive stiepends; most of the U.S. citizen students do not receive full-ride steipends that include living expenses! Only the actual student should be allowed, not a spouse, ect. Then once the student has completed their studies they have one month to go home. If they want to return they can apply for immigration status like my great-great-grandfather did 150 years ago.

It is time for universities to focus on U.S. citizen students. Too many of our good students are being rejected from programs, not because student "slots" are being set aside for international students. This is very wrong.

This is also how undergrad students are getting graduate teaching assistants (GTA's) with minimal English skills. It is not that there are no U.S. citizens looking for the work as a GTA, it is that there is preferential treatment. Often the feds subsidize the position if an international student has the position.

I have met and worked with many very fine international students while a doctoral student. They wanted to get their education and go home. These are the majority. However, I have seen the above senario many, many times.

As to to the H-1B visas. What profession is in short supply of professionals? In the realm of conputing there are many U.S. citizen professionals unemployed. The American Medial Association has repeatedly said there is no major shortage of doctors, except in a few specialies.

If they want to keep the H-1B program the employer should be required to pay a $10,000 fee and post a $100,000 bond. If the person stays beyond the visa, disappears, or stays beyond the needs of that specific employer the bond is revoked. Also H-1B visa holders cannot change employers. If they come in with a specific employer, when they are no longer needed they leave, not find another job. Too many professional folks, that are citizens of the U.S., are looking for work.

Sorry to rant on this, but this is a "hot button" issue with me.
Posted by: drichards1953   Posted on: 09/28/04 You are currently: a Guest | Members login | Terms of Use

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their is somethings foreign outsourcing can't handle  V Sanders | 09/27/04
how about a non-compete clause?  John Le'Brecage | 09/27/04
RE: how about a non-compete clause?  ajapierce | 09/27/04
I say EQUAL pay for EQUAL work  V Sanders | 09/27/04
RE: I say EQUAL pay for EQUAL work  ajapierce | 09/27/04
I say EQUAL pay for EQUAL work  cottom | 09/28/04
How about a hot cup of GET THE HELL OUT???  No_Ax_to_Grind | 09/27/04
Does a red dot in the middle of there forehead mean leave?  cybershoplifter | 09/28/04
No such days ever existed.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 09/28/04
I have to agree with you..  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
Twisted perceptions  Theo19 | 09/28/04
This may be...  AmusedAtItAll | 09/28/04
The end of America and Japan is very near.  bowling_z | 09/27/04
Same here  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
I doubt it.  Roger Ramjet | 09/28/04
Stealing?  rapson | 09/28/04
Yes, against thier will. It happens  voska | 09/28/04
Against their will  Middle of the Road | 09/28/04
What did you expect?  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Problems Ahead  Roger Ramjet | 09/28/04
Re: Problems Ahead  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
TIME TO OUTSOURCE THE SENATE!!!  Jeff Spicoli | 09/28/04
Actually alot of companies...  +-Chris-+ | 09/28/04
Not hinking with a full tank of brain cells...  Domb2 | 09/28/04
No suprises here...  BitTwiddler | 09/28/04
DELL  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Apple  Roger Ramjet | 09/28/04
Economies evolve  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Full Employment  Middle of the Road | 09/28/04
Re: Full Employment  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Dell  Middle of the Road | 09/28/04
Question..  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
Re: Question  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Question  Middle of the Road | 09/28/04
Thanks..  Patrick Jones | 09/29/04
Now this I would like to see  Squawkbox | 09/28/04
Hear Hear!  e_annie | 09/28/04
Tip of the iceburg  drichards1953 | 09/28/04
Investment?  rapson | 09/28/04
Re: Investment  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Re:Re: Investment  Roger Ramjet | 09/28/04
Funny Logic  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Unless..  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
Yes...  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
IP Is Not Protected Anywhere  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
Investment  Middle of the Road | 09/28/04
As long as Business runs the US Govt....  redstone | 09/28/04
That's correct!  FirstNLastN | 09/28/04
Exactly  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Equal pay for Equal work should NOT stop at the borders  V Sanders | 09/28/04
I outsourced to Russia  interlocutor | 09/28/04
The cost is NOT less...  e_annie | 09/28/04
Get a grip...  Theo19 | 09/28/04
what a deal???  baggymaus | 10/25/04
We live in a global economy  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Difference between competition and evisceration...  redstone | 09/28/04
Re: Differences  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Like I said before - question of magnitude.  redstone | 09/28/04
Problems...  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
Rural place don't want the jobs  voska | 09/28/04
Farmer/Programmer  Roger Ramjet | 09/28/04
Actually you would find very good programmers  voska | 09/28/04
Translated  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Death and Taxes..  Patrick Jones | 09/28/04
Where is most IT spent?  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Not quite true John.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 09/28/04
ok john, lets use that comparison  V Sanders | 09/28/04
Farm subsidies  Patrick Jones | 09/29/04
What's new about that?  voska | 09/28/04
Or, is it the path of least resistance.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 09/28/04
The problem...  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
Swimming against the current.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 09/28/04
Ax -- I agree with you!!  drichards1953 | 09/28/04
Microsoft already outsources jobs!  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
Spoken like a true left winger...  Rodo1 | 09/28/04
Huh?  John Carroll ZDNet Moderator | 09/28/04
RE:Huh?  Rodo1 | 09/28/04
re huh  V Sanders | 09/28/04
John Carrol Is Ill Informed  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
You left out an important part...  DB_z | 09/29/04
Schools Are Caught Up in Numbers Game.  brenthawkinsmd | 09/28/04
H1B and Student visas  cottom | 09/28/04
Whats the problem ?  milinshah@... | 09/28/04
More H1B visas. Can you spell IDIOT?  sysdev@... | 09/28/04
There is nothing to weigh  Rodo1 | 09/28/04
This works FOR comanies & AGAINST workers  baldwinleo@... | 09/28/04
This works FOR companies & AGAINST workers  baldwinleo@... | 09/28/04
America : for the Company, by the company(NT)  V Sanders | 09/28/04
With 20-30% Unemployment in IT, The Last  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
Automation also takes jobs away.  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
No Issue With Automation & Efficiency  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
Consumers don't produce things!  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
You're right! Consumers Don't Produce Things  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
no!  V Sanders | 09/28/04
You know the cost of living in other regions of the world?  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
RE: You know the cost of living in other regions of the world?  thetruth_z | 09/29/04
Yes - define "cost of Living"  IAFarm2 | 09/29/04
Most of the posts here sure do make a stong arguement!  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
Economic Analysis For BOFH  Rick Morrow | 09/28/04
Just says you have to adapt to changes!  B.O.F.H. | 09/28/04
Interesting  rapson | 09/29/04
The most pernicious visa's ever  vectrav2 | 09/28/04
BAD senator, no H1-B Visa.  liqour43@... | 09/28/04
almost all customer service jobs will be outsourced by 2006  V Sanders | 09/28/04
the more low level customer service jobs go overseas  V Sanders | 09/28/04
Whose education are we paying taxes to support  IAFarm2 | 09/29/04
As a recent Legal Immigrant to the US (45 days)  Uralbas | 09/29/04

What do you think?

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