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check your facts ... Gates did little to make PC buisness ready
......and if I may humbly add one point. Bill Gates helped get computing away from massive main frames as was pointed out in an earlier post. When Linux is accepted onto the business desktop it will end up in homes ala Windows either in the form of a desktop box or laptop.

Blah.

I have used PC's from before DOS 1.0 and the IBM PC set the standard for the dumb terminal replacement.

MS never provided the app or anything else that exclusively caused PC's to succeed in the business environment.

First it ws Apple II with VisiCalc that proved the viability of the PC as a platform for manageers to use to analyze numbers and better manage their departments - their peers noticed how they made heads up decisions using the spreadsheet "tool" and they got one too. In this timeframe, companies did not buy PC's managers did using personal funds.

Then IBM built the PC and brought MS along as the OS and BASIC OEM. Again it was VisiCalc and later Lotus 1-2-3 which made the PC viable. Herculese Graphics, Autocad, and WordStar all had more impact than MS in this early Intel timeframe - MS ... well most people bought PC-DOS back then!

Then we had COMPAQ who created the luggable and again Managers jumped in with personal funds to run spreadsheets on their PC both at work and at home. Corporations did not buy PC's back then in anything aproaching volume ... it was a chicken and egg thing, the apps and cards needed to exist before the value was compelling - this was back in Gates' "640K is more than anyone could ever use" days.

Then the ISA bus created a market for hardware add ins, first were combined peripheral cards, then the killer app, mainframe connectivity cards. Early network solutions came out using Enet with .... IBM PC Network solution (called Net BIOS or MS's network layer today).

I could go on, but it was not MS who created the business PC market. MS's innovation back then was to go to the PC OEM's and get them to bundle MS-DOS in the PC to create a lower entry price for the customer than if they bought PC-DOS at retail. Ya see, nobody bough MS-DOS at retail ... why would you ... get the one with the IBM logo to run on the IBM compatible - duh!
Posted by: oldskool   Posted on: 04/30/04 You are currently: a Guest | Members login | Terms of Use
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Linux still a way to go.  keith.sloan | 04/30/04
You are not the target market  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
You hit some of the Reason I still run Windows 2K  voska | 04/30/04
You are exactly right, consumers will be the last to switch.  DonnieBoy | 04/30/04
Disagree  paman57@... | 05/03/04
Re: Linux Still has a way to go  dougN | 05/03/04
Good enough...is  issthatso | 04/30/04
Business first, Then home  SC-man | 04/30/04
Exactly...  prime21 | 04/30/04
The future looks bright with FREEdom  Xunil_Sierutuf | 04/30/04
Don't you wish!  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Being the rich means hiring the best PR people you can!  Xunil_Sierutuf | 04/30/04
Robber barons are people, too.  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
"Good Enough" has ben good enough for Microsoft.  casbo | 04/30/04
Good Enough was good enough  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
did ya hear about the new marketing campaign - open an account and get a PC  oldskool | 04/30/04
Where did you get that?  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Not to mention...  ShadeTree | 04/30/04
What Games?  voska | 04/30/04
XP is pushing me to Linux  voska | 04/30/04
Thank you  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
And yuo clim to know something about Windows???  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
I don't have turn off Wizards in Linux  voska | 04/30/04
Wizards  PA-ITGuy | 04/30/04
Yeah, uhh, ooooooookay...  ?? | 04/30/04
Yes, some will not switch until there are more apps.  DonnieBoy | 05/01/04
White men can't jump  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
True, but....  NemesisNL | 04/30/04
Don't speak too soon  doctormoriarty | 04/30/04
Who's gonna pay?  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Companies still train employees  doctormoriarty | 04/30/04
Really?  Linux User 147560 | 04/30/04
Training?  NemesisNL | 05/01/04
Message has been deleted.  ?? | 04/30/04
IBM. HP, Intel, AMD, Sun and others can jump & CAN MARKET  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
J.M. you win the spot on prize of the day  Squawkbox | 04/30/04
Actually, B. Gates had squat to do with mainframe downfall  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Correction (of somebody)  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Your conclusion is correct  IT_User | 04/30/04
check your facts ... Gates did little to make PC buisness ready  oldskool | 04/30/04
Oh yeah - one more thing, MS was an APPLE vendor  oldskool | 04/30/04
You guys forgot CPM, ConCurrent DOS..  zackszoo | 04/30/04
Gates Quote  SC-man | 04/30/04
Where did you see that?  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Try this  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
tried it  eLurker | 04/30/04
Don't look now  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
You guys are arguing past one another  IT_User | 04/30/04
Thanks  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Right attack, wrong target  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
False statement  NemesisNL | 05/01/04
They are NOT marketing end user systems!  balsover | 04/30/04
Whoever is telling you about business  IT_User | 04/30/04
re: huge retraining costs...  ryusen | 04/30/04
Before you can plug a hole, you have to build...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
As if Windows is a proper container  Grimm Reaper | 04/30/04
Which is it that you hate?  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Message has been deleted.  Xunil_Sierutuf | 04/30/04
Huh  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Violated the rules..  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Gotcha  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
LOL, well you didn't deny the Bill G. blowup doll  Xunil_Sierutuf | 04/30/04
plugging holes  eLurker | 04/30/04
see now that was funny .)  ryusen | 04/30/04
We need enought apps to get a critical mass.  DonnieBoy | 04/30/04
And only after that will I switch  zijiang | 04/30/04
Yes, consumers will be the last to switch.  DonnieBoy | 04/30/04
Bruce - Dump your Windows box  Eggs Ackley_z | 04/30/04
Don't give people what they want - tell them they're stupid!  archerjoe | 04/30/04
Better yet:  wploger | 04/30/04
Accountant  SC-man | 04/30/04
cost/benifit?  ryusen | 04/30/04
IE only  Just Me_z | 04/30/04
Switch the User Agent  Yagotta B. Kidding | 04/30/04
Plugging the Linux holes  Loverock Davidson | 04/30/04
Flimsy argument  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Confused- Quicken on Windows???  wploger | 04/30/04
Get on board...  Chad_z | 04/30/04
Another Reason NOT TO BUY LINUX  RobertoSalazar | 04/30/04
All right Roberto...  wploger | 04/30/04
Your visionary, McBride, just went blind....  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
Go to bed and no internet for you!  trojanhorse | 04/30/04
Who uses cheques anymore?  voska | 04/30/04
missing the point  dabrooks | 04/30/04
Probably a losing battle  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
You're right.  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
can't comment  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Support by forum  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Support by forum  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
"Facts" to fit  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
What A Load That Was  nikoli | 04/30/04
reread  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Smart custodial engineers  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Yeah Okay  mudfoot | 05/02/04
d be much happier if Linux would try to find its own path  wploger | 04/30/04
Why do they have to FOLLOW anyone?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Answer: It just makes sense  voska | 04/30/04
Ease of Use is good  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Be more specific.  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
Get Real Spam Man  nikoli | 04/30/04
Get Real Spam Man  nikoli | 04/30/04
Not really...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Think that's what he's suggesting?  IT_User | 04/30/04
A second place follower is okay though?  tic swayback | 04/30/04
It's really about commoditization, but you deny that, Micro$hill.  dicktaurus@... | 04/30/04
Why do they have to FOLLOW anyone?  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
What a silly and useless post.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Wow, you mean you had no adequate response to Spam-ZD, huh?  dicktaurus@... | 04/30/04
Maybe, but you post is just plain useless  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
Didn't use the word follow...  wploger | 04/30/04
I agree with you.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
You're missing very large market segments  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
The double edged sword!  George Mitchell | 04/30/04
One problem  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
On moving ahead  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
I don't quite agree...  Linux_Developer | 04/30/04
short term thinking  zijiang | 04/30/04
George, you forget patents.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Adobe faces bigger obstacles  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Bigger PDF problem: it reeks  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
You're not using it correctly  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Partly affirm  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Here's a recent example  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
MS hopes to survive on patents?  Spam-ZD | 04/30/04
Head, meet the sand...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
A dose of reality  IT_User | 04/30/04
You aren't looking at the real picture.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
And just who are the contributors?  IT_User | 04/30/04
So they can't copy it...  Linux User 147560 | 04/30/04
Patents are a double edged sword ...  George Mitchell | 04/30/04
Agree and disagree  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Re: Agree and disagree  George Mitchell | 04/30/04
New Advertising Slogan  zijiang | 04/30/04
I ask an honest question.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Ok  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
I can think of dozens of things...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Good list, but pc vs. dedicated device?  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Who knows really...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
You lost me.  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Could it be we need...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Deep Thought; or, all the world's a peripheral  Anton Philidor | 04/30/04
Keep it simple  quietLee | 04/30/04
Thats why  RedHat9User | 04/30/04
Off the top of my head...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Good ideas  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Chicken and egg argument is a fact of life.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Interesting points  voska | 04/30/04
Suggestions lead to the very sins of which he questions.  John Le'Brecage | 04/30/04
And where can I buy them?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 05/02/04
Re: I ask an honest question.  mbraincell@... | 04/30/04
Glad to know I'm not the only one asking.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Proprietary software is not the only place for innovation.  B.O.F.H. | 05/01/04
Not true:  wploger | 04/30/04
From the beginning  PA-ITGuy | 04/30/04
Honest question  Rick_K | 05/03/04
As honest an answer I can give  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
The "bricks" have been there for years.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Unfortunately...  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Has a second rate, "me too" product ever worked?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
You helped prove my point on that reply  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Is that really true?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Reply to No Axe  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Yes...  wploger | 04/30/04
And here I thought you had something to say.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
You're making his point for him  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Huh? What are you talking about?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
OSS doesn't necessarily mean no name brand  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Paying for quality  tic swayback | 04/30/04
Because I don't agree it's the case at all.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Regardless  tic swayback | 04/30/04
tic  pschroeder@... | 04/30/04
tic, features, functions, and applications.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 05/01/04
To Ax; Perception  tic swayback | 05/02/04
To further make the point.  Rick_K | 05/03/04
You mean MS-DOS?  Yagotta B. Kidding | 04/30/04
And what has that to do with the topic?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
You asked  Yagotta B. Kidding | 04/30/04
Brand name !=  Linux User 147560 | 04/30/04
windows has become the generic OS.  B.O.F.H. | 05/02/04
You need the plans, too  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Is Mozilla OSS?  IT_User | 04/30/04
I suspect that you are slightly confused.  B.O.F.H. | 04/30/04
Yes and No  tic swayback | 04/30/04
Let's face it.  Yen_z | 04/30/04
So why is MS Office the NUMBER 1 seller for Macs?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
A possible reason  Michael Kelly | 04/30/04
Nope...  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Because  j.m.galvin | 04/30/04
Obvious  tic swayback | 04/30/04
Obvious, its the best out there.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 04/30/04
Wrong again there bitty  Rick_K | 05/03/04
Simple...  wploger | 04/30/04
But what have you now?  StorageGuru | 04/30/04
Xbox  tic swayback | 04/30/04
IBM Right?  nikoli | 05/01/04
IBM makes the G5 chip.  Rick_K | 05/03/04
almost right...  jimk_z | 04/30/04
Insurance ?  mbraincell@... | 04/30/04
no Games on Linux PERFECT!  jkerr | 04/30/04
Quicken  mabricen | 04/30/04
Stomping of the little feet....  quietLee | 04/30/04
LOL, You are soooo right  nikoli | 04/30/04
Re: #4  PA-ITGuy | 05/01/04
NEXT, BeOS, OS2, Linux..Next  jimk_z | 04/30/04
Eventually  CobraA1 | 04/30/04
Message has been deleted.  trojanhorse | 04/30/04
Message has been deleted.  trojanhorse | 04/30/04
Why?  PA-ITGuy | 05/01/04
Get some games on Linux then Bravo  FilledOut | 05/04/04
Handicapped accessibility  susancragin@... | 08/31/04

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