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Science vs. Religion
From what I've read, fear over the LHC has to do with real or unreal likelihood of the inadvertent formation of a black hole. I don't see how that is a religious issue. As for religion and. science: both seek after the truth about all things. Their approaches are different, and in many cases, both polluted with error. Science tries to determine the truth about things by (for the most part) directly observing physical phenomena. This process however is fundamentally flawed, in that it seems to assume that if man cannot for the most part directly perceive something, it does not exist, or it does not deserve consideration. We know that it is silly to say that if man cannot perceive something it does not exist, because that would mean that deaf men would be justified in dismissing claims by the hearing, that a world of sounds exist which they are unable to directly perceive. Further, a wealth of information man concludes to be true, he does via deduction - not direct observation. E.g., no one can see a black hole directly, but we can note circumstances which point to the existence of black holes. Now given the fact that man can only directly perceive about 2.5% of the electromagnetic spectrum, and a relatively small range of sound frequencies, this and other evidence points to the likelihood that man is, in the grand scheme of things, barely able to perceive the things around him. In other words, man is comparatively blind.

Now, in as much as it is virtually hopeless for a society of completely physically blind men to discover and make accurate assessments of their environment, at a level comparable to a society of seeing men, it is utterly hopeless that men can discover the truth about the universe using science. This is why science essentially guesses at the way things are (through theories), and technically offers no guarantees that what it proposes is true. No one knows if Einstein's theory of relativity is true: everyone simply assumes it to be true, recognizing it is the best explanation of things we have about the physical world around us.

Now if it is virtually impossible for science to explain the world we live in with assurance, we are left with no other choice but to rely on explanations provided by beings who purport to have created the world. (Who better to explain how a house has been built, than the man who built it?) The question then arises, how do we distinguish fact from fiction? We look at natural laws. Not just natural physical laws: all types of natural laws. In our observations around us, we see that nothing gives rise to something substantially greater than itself. Things only progress in the opposite direction: i.e. creatures only give rise to things lesser than themselves. This completely undermines the theory of evolution (which incidentally is not supported by one shred of irrefutable evidence), and confirms many aspects of religion (e.g. Gnosticism, Cabbalism) which states that all things that exist are a series of emanations from a highest ultimate source, to the lowest source. Another important natural law is that an intelligent being is required to produce order, and the more sophisticated the order, the greater the required intelligence. (You cannot get a house to randomly construct itself. You need men in order to build it; and the more sophisticated the house, the more intelligent the men have to be.) This simple law further undermines evolution, and is consistent with explanations by religion that beings of great intellect created the things that exist. Further, religion indicates that all things that exist, are essentially a massive assembly in beings of various kinds. This is consistent with man's observations that all things have their bounds, are regulated, and have complex ordered associations and interactions. Therefore the idea that there are spirit beings that are responsible for clouds, who ensure that clouds behave certain ways within limits, are consistent with man's observation that clouds show ordering for which intelligent beings are required to establish and maintain. All of this suggest that all things that exist (time, jealousy, love, etc.) are beings who establish and maintain these things.

Natural law also shows us that perfection and truth lies only in those things that are good. This is how a person is able to critically distinguish the truth from a maze of fiction and deception that exist within this world. This is consistent with Jesus' claim, "By their fruits will you know them." Therefore the truth about all things lie only within people and things that are truly, fundamentally good. Christianity and related religions indicate that this goodness can only be achieved by having faith. [url=http://tinyurl.com/6lr6od]Jesus in Mark 11:22-24 indicates that having faith is specifically the process of asking God for things, and believing that you will receive them[/url]. All of this can be confirmed by empirical observations, which in turn support the fact that no one can know the truth about things, save via the proper pursuit of religion.

Therefore as I said before, science can never explain our world with any guarantees of accuracy. All it can do is propose what our world is like. However, given the horrible weakness of our senses, any proposal we can come up with is virtually guaranteed to be terribly flawed. Man therefore has no choice but to rely on accounts by beings who created all things (whose existence is confirmed by natural law), and to distinguish their sayings from myth, via the goodness of the sources of various accounts.

True religion is not the ranting of irrational men. In fact it is the complete opposite. The problem is that religion is filled with wannabes who establish and follow flawed doctrines - all the time proclaiming to be men of God. A truly religious man (vs. a play actor) shows fundamental (not superficial) goodness, and bears out the Bible's claim that true goodness comes only by having faith, and that having faith is specifically the practice of asking God for things, while believing that you will receive them - Mark 11:22-24.
Posted by: P. Douglas   Posted on: 09/09/08 You are currently: a Guest | Members login | Terms of Use

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Opposition to LHC  Ocker3 | 09/08/08
Probability  MooseBoys | 09/09/08
Not that ignorant ...  PrimeCustomerPrim | 09/09/08
maybe not ignorant, but certainly uninformed  alaire | 09/09/08
But the scientists have to talk to us too  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
LHC rap  alaire | 09/10/08
Who is this 'you' that you speak of?  HogsInBudapest | 09/09/08
False arguements  donj81 | 09/14/08
"fools"  midenginedrift | 09/15/08
"fools"  midenginedrift | 09/15/08
Science/Christianity/Politics  wrcflier@... | 09/15/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  eolson22 | 09/09/08
Faith Based Science  duncanofbegany | 09/09/08
I concur  jahcriado | 09/09/08
Eugenics  lambert.heenan@... | 09/10/08
Faith Based Science  lambert.heenan@... | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  kakman1@... | 09/09/08
with you  pkkm | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  kakman1@... | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  testcfg | 09/09/08
about whale  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Black Holes  duncanofbegany | 09/09/08
Christianity is not Anti-Science  Khomar | 09/09/08
Good Post!  iTeaBoy | 09/09/08
Risks  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Superb post!  dan.nutley@... | 09/09/08
Nicely put  HogsInBudapest | 09/09/08
Probably deliberate misguiding  pkkm | 09/09/08
Actually, I'd be happy with just re-emphasizing  frgough | 09/09/08
Understanding God's mind  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Um...no!! You're not getting away with that one!!  techboy_z | 09/09/08
OK, I am a real scientist . . .  caburlingame | 09/16/08
Is String Theory Testable?  cdawson2000 | 09/11/08
Let the facts stand on their own  erivera@... | 09/09/08
Heartily agree  duncanofbegany | 09/09/08
The trouble with intelligent design  Benji80 | 09/09/08
Intelligent design  lfrankow@... | 09/09/08
Re: Intelligent design  pkkm | 09/09/08
Wel that is very easy...  Jim Blaine - Bellingham WA. | 09/09/08
Not true at all  frgough | 09/09/08
read Dover vs kitzmiller  pkkm | 09/09/08
unfortunate  pkkm | 09/09/08
Could be a good fellow and please  Jim Blaine - Bellingham WA. | 09/09/08
Apologies  erivera@... | 09/09/08
You're welcome.  Jim Blaine - Bellingham WA. | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  latenight18 | 09/09/08
thanks for that  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  ehealthshop | 09/09/08
Science is not about 'belief'  Benji80 | 09/09/08
Nothing new in Xianity  pkkm | 09/09/08
Correct - Christianity came from Judaism  iTeaBoy | 09/09/08
Re: Correct - Christianity came from Judaism  pkkm | 09/09/08
Cautionary note  cmentmixer | 09/09/08
Re: Cautionay note  pkkm | 09/09/08
"No gods before Me"  cmentmixer | 09/09/08
Re: No Gods before me  pkkm | 09/09/08
Sanatana Dharma  cmentmixer | 09/09/08
Re: Sanatana Dharma  pkkm | 09/09/08
Hell hath no fury  cmentmixer | 09/09/08
True science  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Doubting Apollo and doubting Darwin are Different  dan.nutley@... | 09/09/08
Zing?  HogsInBudapest | 09/09/08
"Are you a fundamentalist Darwinist?"  alan_4195 | 09/09/08
Agreed.  HogsInBudapest | 09/09/08
Re: Agreed  pkkm | 09/09/08
Our default magical worldview v our instinct for science  dpnewkirk | 09/09/08
Re: Are you a fundamentalist Darwinist  pkkm | 09/09/08
Worth a look:  HogsInBudapest | 09/10/08
Physicist?  pkkm | 09/09/08
post hoc fallacy  frgough | 09/09/08
so is Big Bang theory  pkkm | 09/09/08
Excellent post  iPlant | 09/09/08
Mr. Koman and friends are obvious bigots.  Komanisanidiot | 09/09/08
in the court  pkkm | 09/09/08
Who are the real fundamentalists?  oldduck | 09/09/08
modern newton  pkkm | 09/09/08
They would have gotten the knowledge  John L. Ries | 09/09/08
Blame Dan Brown  humble_perfesser | 09/09/08
Blame Mary Shelley  John L. Ries | 09/09/08
Creation + Evolution?  iTeaBoy | 09/09/08
faith vs science, actually  barence773 | 09/09/08
Faith is tested everyday my friend  iTeaBoy | 09/09/08
Re: Faith is tested everyday my friend  pkkm | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Mungomunro | 09/09/08
You're funny  mijori | 09/09/08
global warming  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Is Evolution Science?  MikeInVa | 09/09/08
Scientific ignorance  pkkm | 09/09/08
wiki is cool  pkkm | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  robbiemckay@... | 09/09/08
Yawn  frgough | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  carlino | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  pkkm | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Attrezzo Pox | 09/09/08
LHC DOES have potential to end the world  cphil19 | 09/09/08
Ohhhh, a doctor  HogsInBudapest | 09/09/08
Truth  cphil19 | 09/09/08
Sorry. I just...  HogsInBudapest | 09/10/08
Well then...  Jim Blaine - Bellingham WA. | 09/09/08
Palin photo is a fake  tonyr123 | 09/09/08
Re: Palin photo is a fake  Attrezzo Pox | 09/09/08
Re: Palin photo is a fake  tonyr123 | 09/09/08
Sarcasm... ah yes... well in that case there is this  Jim Blaine - Bellingham WA. | 09/09/08
Really.  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Works both ways  John L. Ries | 09/09/08
Industry  rkoman@... | 09/09/08
Agreed  John L. Ries | 09/09/08
E=mc(2)  cdawson2000 | 09/11/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  cphil19 | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  dcalto | 09/09/08
Science vs. Religion  P. Douglas | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  pkkm | 09/09/08
Faith and reason: not incompatible!!  techboy_z | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  mr.richardthomas@... | 09/09/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Noneofoyourbusiness | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Noneofoyourbusiness | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Noneofoyourbusiness | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Noneofoyourbusiness | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  Noneofoyourbusiness | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  XFunc_CaRteR | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  XFunc_CaRteR | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  XFunc_CaRteR | 09/10/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  XFunc_CaRteR | 09/10/08
Indoctrination of Youth with Faith-Based Science  denisenorris@... | 09/10/08
Another possibility of the existence of the universe as we know(?) it  nextbigthing | 09/11/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  cdawson2000 | 09/11/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  gfiandy | 09/15/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  niffirg | 09/18/08
RE: LHC and Faith-Based Science  niffirg | 09/18/08

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